Ep480: John Osberg – Explore Who You Are and Build on That

Andrew Stotz 00:02
Hello fellow risk takers and welcome to my worst investment ever stories of loss to keep you winning. In our community. We know that to win in investing, you must take risks but to win big, you've got to reduce it, go to my worst investment ever.com and join our Facebook group to connect with our community of guests and fellow listeners. Fellow risk takers this is your worst podcast host Andrew Stotz from a Stotz Academy, and I'm here with featured guest, John osberg. John, are you ready to rock?

John Osberg 00:34
Let's do it.

Andrew Stotz 00:36
taking some time to get you on this show, and I'm looking for this episode, I want to introduce you to the audience. John osberg. His life mantra is to serve his serve to soar. John is on a mission to unlock growth in people, businesses, and communities. To help them go from where they currently are, to where they want to be. You'll find his posts on LinkedIn about mental models transformative growth insights, and impactful content sources aimed at professional and personal development. He also showcases acts of egalitarianism, community building, and ladies and gentlemen, make sure to listen to him on his power of osmosis podcast. John, take a minute and feeling further tidbits about your life.

John Osberg 01:28
Well, Doctor stats, I'm gonna call you back your stats, we had that chat off air. I appreciate this opportunity. And your follow through follow up with me, I really enjoyed listening to your show. And so just want to send kudos to you for what you're doing to build this community and unlock insights for all those that are following. You know, the thought leadership that you're putting out there. So big time, kudos, appreciate. Thanks for that intro. That was That was fun. And I've been looking forward to this. So yeah, really the long and short of it for me, I grew up with to public, you know, to public servants, if you will, in the medical field, psychology field. So I got a front row seat growing up to what it is to really serve everyone, serve people selflessly. And to give to give, not what I should say is give to give and not to get right. So it's something that was ingrained in me at a young age. And here, you know, 25 years later, I'm 30. Now, I should say, but, you know, it's something that I just can't get away from. And so I started my career in technology and a startup, I had no idea what startups were I had no idea kind of what we were doing. But the folks that brought me in, saw something in me that at the time I did not see in myself. So I'm super grateful to those folks, for giving me my start and having the faith to work with me through the first few years of my you know, little wrongness, if you will my greenness. So I'm kind of launched my career getting to the startup where you know, a few times as any startup, we almost failed. This is a software development firm. That was three of us when I started there. And then when I left, five years later, we had about 40 people multi state, multi million dollar operation, it was pretty, pretty cool. So anyway, not to go too, you know, too detail, but basically four different stops in my career, the general theme was tech startups. So some volatility, a couple things happen in my career that I guess weren't planned. I didn't see them coming. And put me into an interesting place around the middle, and then into the end of 2019. So about two years ago, I found myself kind of on a bit of a slide, and, you know, was in a place that I couldn't really, you know, physically are, I should say, figuratively, and literally recognize myself, Andrew, in the mirror. And that was what kind of was that final stop for me where I didn't have I wouldn't call it a tier one trauma, which is, in my opinion, something like a heart attack, or a DUI or something crazy, where you're forced to make a change where you're like, Okay, this is it, like jail, or I lost my license or I can't whatever. I had, like a tier two. So it was like, it was the step before getting somewhere really serious. And I knew that I needed to make a change. And so at the end of 2019, I decided to make some changes, things like abstaining from you know, drinking alcohol, and, you know, a lot of other things that really just had to do with personal development that as time went on, especially with COVID head, here in the States, it afforded me an opportunity to really go inward and spend time working on myself. And 60 pounds later starting a business running marathons, ultra endurance events, meeting people and becoming friends with people I never thought you know, I'd be becoming friends with some of these folks are fairly influential and just people who are of true moral fiber. Here I sit, you know, we're into almost quarter four 2021, where my life is almost unrecognizable from where it was maybe two years ago, there are still plenty, plenty of valleys and plenty of struggles, especially even lately vulnerably. And candidly, I've been working through but my life is built on authenticity, which I know is one of the core principles of the show. So kudos again to you, Andrew. And, and just showing of really acts of selflessness, of leadership, of community building and of transformative growth, which is something that I've went through and I'm grateful for. And so my steadfast mission is to help others whether a business, a community organization, or someone individually to unlock their own.

Andrew Stotz 05:43
Hmm. I like what you said about I just wrote it down tier two trauma. And yeah, it reminds me, you know, when I was 16, I was heavily into drugs in, I was in a lot of trouble. And basically, the, there was a new method going around in America at that time, and it was called raise the bottom. And that's where parents were taught to let your child suffer the consequences of their action. You know, in my case, I went to juvenile detention when I was younger, and I had a lot of different troubles. And I got kicked out of school at times, and all kinds of stuff. But my parents kept trying to raise that bottom. And ultimately, I got into treatment. And I went through a couple different three different treatment programs. And then when I was 17, I got out. And I've been sober ever since now, almost 40 years, just celebrated 39 years of that. But I just want to relay, I want to relay a story, I went into a 12 step meeting when I was one, you know, young kid full energy and, and an older guy looked at me, and he said, I spilled more beer on my neck tie than you drank in your whole life. And I and I just thought to myself, I didn't, I didn't say anything I just said to myself, and what's your point? Yeah. And also, when we talk about tier two trauma, I think the lesson I want the listeners to get, you know, from what you've talked about is that we do not have to go to the absolute bottom. And that what I what I learned in my, my life of kind of recovery, was that success is not it's not about failure, not failing, it's about catching yourself, when you're slipping, catching yourself before you let yourself go too far down. So ladies and gentlemen, if you're in tier two trauma, right now, you don't have to go to tier one. And it doesn't have to get worse, you can stop right now and take action to reverse it. So thank you for that.

John Osberg 07:50
Now, and thank you. I'm glad you mentioned that because, you know sharing that story, again, part of that ethos authenticity in the vulnerable piece. A lot of times folks will say, you know, I don't like being vulnerable, it's weakness. And I adamantly come back, conversely, and say, Actually, it's the complete opposite when you are willing to stand nakedly. Right? And say, I am inadequate in these ways. You are You are the strongest you'll ever be. Because that shows that hey, I don't care what people think this is who I am. This is where I'm at. And yeah, it's not great. And but I'm at least aware of it. And I'm working towards a solution of solving this problem. These problems. So kudos to you. And you know, in your last podcast, it was Jacob, was it rogue? I know, I asked you out there. I was listening to that. I heard you mentioned in response, but I don't think you went into detail. So it's almost like you're in my head because I was gonna ask you, as that podcast host, I can't help myself, almost to podcast host having a chat back. But you did it. You already answered it. So again, that's that's beautifully said. And congrats on almost four years. I'm going on two years.

Andrew Stotz 08:53
Fantastic. Fantastic. Let's go. My mother and I went out for dinner and celebrated that. So that was fun. So absolutely fantastic. It really is. Now it's time. It is time. No more waiting. It's time to share your worst investment ever. And since no one goes into their worst investment thinking it will be. Tell us a bit about the circumstances leading up to the Intel's your story.

John Osberg 09:19
Yeah, yeah. As you I'm going to totally just I hope this will get people really hooked in and listening to this because this is not really planned. I mean, I have almost too many worse investments to count, whether they are financial or non financial. And you know, what I would say to you know, the metaphor is I wrote some notes down, I think investing in what others thought of me. You know, throughout my career, I would say probably, you know, year zero through year 567 investing in what others thought of me and solve me kind of my identity and letting them kind of have take over my inner voice, Andrew, that had probably been one of the worst investments ever things like, you know, you're too young, you don't know enough, we need someone more senior in the room with you. Or you know, your energy is great, but you need to work on channeling it, you need to work on harnessing it, you know, these are the things that still played back in my mind often. Because really, my energy and my youthful exuberance and my creativity are some of my greatest strengths. And it took you like I said, 789 years, a lot of soul searching to finally realize that and again, to this day, there are times where I feel like man, like should I have this much energy? Should I be this, you know, exuberant for this opportunity for this speaking event? You know, am I overdoing it? And then I've realized that those are those other voices that don't have that they have no place in my mind in my brain? So I would say, you know, metaphorically speaking, that's probably that's probably the best answer. And, and really, I guess it can't, you know, convert, you know, consequently, than not investing properly into myself into my true ethos. But financially, I will say this, when you when you're in the startup world, and this is something that really has been hot topic for the last year, two years, because of starting my own business, and you really have to sharpen your focus, Andrew, as you might guess, you know, with being a business, multiple business owner, you got to sharpen your focus on your finances. And I have not said this on any podcast or any online content. So just this moment here. So this is my first try that I have made more financial mistakes, and I can count on my two hands and maybe even my toes. What do I mean by that? What I was saying just a second ago that when you get into the startup world, a lot of times you don't have that stability, you don't have that, that establishment of like, you know, benefits, and 401k and Ira and all this stuff. So for the majority of my career, I didn't really have any of that backing, and I was fine by the seat of my pants. I also had some unique circumstances in my life where when I did finally move out of the house, my family home, I just, I just needed the newest, the latest, the greatest, you know, I had the sweet car, I had the custom suits, I had the country club, I had I bought a boat once. And literally that would probably be dollar for dollar Andrew my worst ever investment because I bought a boat. And I probably use it three times over two years, and I probably set $30,000 on fire. So hopefully when this does get released, there's some people going like, wow, don't buy that boat. Yeah, wow, that's out another 1000 below 80. People joke with me. I know it's funny. And then I got it. I was like, bust out another 30,000 Maybe, instead of 1000. So, so I think I've answered a couple things. And I'd be I'd be open the floor to anything that stuck out to you to go.

Andrew Stotz 12:49
You know, let's talk about this. I like this. The thing about talking about investing in yourself and not, you know, investing too much in what other people think and that type of stuff. Tell me what lessons have you learned having gone through that and coming out of that? And looking at that differently? What are the lessons that you've learned?

John Osberg 13:11
Well, one of the biggest lessons for me, Andrew wise, now that I've I've lived, you know, 30 years, right maybe called 10 years in the business world as a careerist. The one thing for me is, is it's all about that next generation. So I've really even though I have so many mentors, that that the reason I am where I am today I can, I can thank them. I'm also a mentor to a lot of people. And it took some time to really fully realize that probably because of those voices. You're too young, we need someone more senior, you have too much energy. I've been meant I've been actively mentoring more people. And one of the biggest things I say and this is a quote that I derived from just recently passed Trevor Milan, who is a mental conditioning was a mental conditioning coach, one of the best in the world, God rest his soul. He would say, if you're good enough, you're old enough. I'll say that again. If you're good enough, you're old enough. Right? And, and listen, there are things I grew up with a psychologist, right. So our brains don't fully fuse to about 25 years old. There are certain decision making cognitive things that happen I get it. But I know plenty of 1819 2021 year olds that are starting businesses, one of which in Buffalo, New York, she's 18 and she's a multi millionaire. multimillionaire. And not to say that money is the biggest, you know, you know, whatever the we're measurement of success. It isn't. But she's incredible. And she's rocking it. And so for me, it's just realizing that we all have greatness in us, like the great Les Brown would say, right, you know, like, we all have greatness in us. You have greatness within you. It's a matter of finding it right. And maybe I'm not Tiger Woods on the golf course. And maybe I'm not Trevor Melotte as a mental conditioning or life coach or whatever. But I am something I am someone and I have some That can't be replicated. So the lesson that I take out of all those, those those kind of concussive, you know, your time will come. And you know what all these things I've sent out a couple times is, now the time is here, and the time is now. And I, if I take my shot, and sure if I miss, well, at least I took the shot, and I'm gonna learn from making that mistake. But I'd rather do that and have it be theoretically presented to me saying, you know, what, you probably should sit this one out, because you're not, you know, senior enough or experienced enough or, or whatever, I hated feeling. I'll finish this with this Android. I just I hated feeling almost handcuffed sometimes in meetings and conversations, where I was really just a fly on the wall. And while it was great to listen and take notes, I definitely, you know, for when, you know, a lot of opportunity to sharpen kind of my iron in building relationships, building business opportunities, because I was just listening, and sitting there and not being able to be a part of the conversation. So yeah, well, let

Andrew Stotz 15:59
me share a few things. I mean, I want to think about when I was younger, I was I was pretty insecure. I felt like I was a skinny kid, and I couldn't, you know, defend myself against big kids. And I didn't really, you know, I wouldn't say that women were attracted to me, you know, like, I was just like, a real ordinary guy. And I didn't see myself as anything. And I remember one, one of the counselors, his name was Roland Manor. And he basically said, this is I mean, we're talking 40 years ago, this, he said, we were in a group therapy session, he said, stand up in front of that mirror over there. And I was like, yes, just look at yourself. He said, You're the tallest and biggest person in the room. And I was like, I just never saw myself in that way. And I never, it was hard to start to develop this idea that I could have my own identity, I could be who I wanted to be. I think my youth was not like about that. And then then I got built my great friendship with my best friend Dale, and we've been friends for, you know, years. But they'll, they'll tougher. And he was brought in his brother, I was raised with two, two sisters, and you know, a different type of environment. He was tougher. And one day we were in LA, and somebody said something. And Dale said, if you have a problem with that, that's your problem. As long as like, you can think that way. You can say that. Yeah. And his little bit, I go back to the story of the guy that said, I spill more beer on my neck die than you drank in your life. And what I what I now would say if I was in there, I said, I'm really sorry about that, sir. That you had to do that. Not a very good reflection. You know,

John Osberg 17:55
the point, you know what that is? Andrew, that's sorry, I don't want to speak you know, that, to me is action right? Now, I definitely finished your job. But that's just projecting insecurities and things on us, where we have to be, you know, acutely aware at all times, where you hear things, see things and have to ask yourself, is this person projecting something on me that's within them? Right, and don't take offense? Because that's just, that's just their insecurity, that's their struggle, their problem. And I think in the world, if we took that approach a little bit, you know, more seriously, I think that would help kind of lessen some of the tensions we see economically, politically, socially. So I'm sorry, continue.

Andrew Stotz 18:31
Um, my niece always said that, you know, she said to me that, you know, people have their trauma behind the scenes that you know, nothing about, and that was, that was a good reminder of that. But I think the other thing I was it made me think about too, is I get, I get young people who asked me about, you know, careers and all that. I was in Hong Kong, and I spoke at an event and a bunch of students came up to talk to me, and this one girl said to me, you know, I want to study finance, you know, but I'm in accounting, and I heard it's, you know, I heard it's, you know, hard to make that transition, or whatever. I said, Who told you that? I don't know. So I heard it from what, Who? Who? Who has a right? To tell you that? Right on and, you know, if you want to do it, and I say to you, oftentimes I preface my advice to young people, I'm not really the best person to ask advice from because I don't give a crap, what you think, I'm going to pursue my life. I moved to Thailand when I was, you know, 26 years old, to just pursue my dream. So in some ways, you know, you could say, I'm selfish, but in the other way, you can also say that, you know, I, I've tried to live my, my truth. And, oh, nice thing is one last thing I want to say is that I think about when I met a girl, a lady here in Thailand, she's a teacher. And I asked her, you know, what do you teach? And she said, I teach, you know, young kids that have ADHD. And, you know, of course, I was, you know, a hyper kid, and they put me on Ritalin. When I was seven years old. I didn't know that until I later found it out. And when I was many years older, I didn't know how early they started me on, I knew I was taking it as I was more aware. And basically, I said, How do you feel about it? And she says, I just feel really sorry for these kids. You know, and I just sat there, and I said, and I said, you know, I'm ADHD. And I can tell you, I really feel sorry, I was in a room with 100 kids. And all of them sat and listened to the boring his teacher talk about the stupidest stuff. And they didn't move an inch. I feel sorry for them. I feel happy that I have the energy and the passion, and I jump, and I got so much in me that I just want to bow. And she's like, Oh, my God, I never thought of that. And I was like, right. And I said, and I've had it all my life, you know, and, you know, what I did? I hire people around me that are steady, Eddie's you know, so I can go to my mountaintop, and then you know, I'll crash boom, and then I'll be out of out of communication for a little bit, and then I'll come back, and then I'll go to my mountaintop. And the point is, is that many people around me, don't ever want to go to that mountaintop. They just want to be steady. So there's a place for all of us.

John Osberg 21:27
Hmm, that resonates usually with me. I just want to step back quickly. But I want to hit that point, too. There's a great book for our listeners and watchers. What happened to you by Oprah? It's it's recently released, I think, maybe in the last couple years, and it's all about trauma. It's all about unpacking trauma. And that's the question we can ask ourselves, when we are in public, or, you know, something happens, you see someone on TV is, you know, where someone's doing something that's maybe out of line with, you know, what you feel is appropriate, or, you know, along your principles is what happened in that person. What's causing them to be this way, you know, get even road rage as an example. Dr. Stotz, you know, someone, someone's zipping by cuts you off, you know, what's, what's happening to them, or what happened to them, maybe because I've seen people were just the smallest thing I love to study people wherever I go, especially driving. And you see, just like, the smallest thing sets people off. And there's a there's an equation to that caffeine, not sleeping enough, eating fast food, not exercising, watching the news constantly. I mean, it goes on and on and on. And it's just it's, you know, vicious cycle. But I want to come back to what you just said with, you know, you can be who you want to be. And that's something that I'm actually currently struggling with still. It's something that I'm working on where it's like, you just said something there where I am also someone of vitality, right? That's another buzzword I love it to us is strength, energy, vibrance, and I can tell you're the same way. And it's like I do want to be studied, because that's self, you know, self preserving story, right? Meaning if you're constantly high energy, or you have these bouts of volatility of like high energy, and then you have to crash. So for me, in my case, that doesn't seem very sustainable for me. So I'm trying to find that balance, right. I feel like life I'm curious, if you agree is a constant beta test, right? We're just even if it's super small, we're just introducing maybe a new behavior a new routine to see how does that do? Like, is that something that serves me or does it not serve me. And it can also go though, the too far, where it's like, you're constantly changing things, and it can get overwhelming and it's there's not a lot of predictability to life. So, but I love what you said, to come back to that it just, we all can be who we want to be. And when you find that inner strength to just come out and say, This is me, that's where life gets really good. That's where life gets really good, man, because you're just live in, like you said, living your truth. Great phrase.

Andrew Stotz 23:57
Yep. So that's, I think, you know, and for the lesson for the listeners out there, you know, we do what our parents tell us, we do what society tells us, you know, and there's, there's a lot of value there. You know, I, I just, I think it's an important thing to remember that if you're, if you are a person with a lot of energy, if you're a person that, you know, is like what we've talked about you You don't have to oppose everybody. You know, I always say that if you think on your, on your own, use your own brain, you can come to your own conclusions. And I love that, you know, I love reading, reading, I love talking to people I love trying to figure out how do I come up with my own? Is there going to be inflation or deflation? Is the Fed going to do this or that? Is this company management going to be able to execute that, you know, in my world of finance, I love to think about these things. And I think the world of finance is so great because, you know, you can have all of your twisted, distorted beliefs and you can test them out on the stock market. There you go. And you'll find that you'll find the kind of consensus truth. And there'll be some small number of times in your career, where you'll be writing consensus be wrong, but most of the time, you know, and you can test. And the problem we have in our lives with a lot of things that are going on right now is that it's, it's not easy for people to test their theories. And I think that's part of, you know, when I worked on my PhD part of it, you know, a huge part of it is how do you test a theory? How do you try to disprove a theory? And so I just liked the idea of being able to form your own ideas and formulate opinions, but it doesn't mean that you have to oppose everybody.

John Osberg 25:43
So good. Yeah, that's so good.

Andrew Stotz 25:45
So love that. Let's, let's, let's, let's talk about, you know, I kind of want to think also about what you talked about tier two trauma. And I want to think about people that are struggling, that are listening. And, you know, they're struggling to kind of become themselves and, you know, start to live their, their own, you know, passion and all that. And tell us, what one action would you recommend that they take to avoid suffering the same fate or avoid suffering the same fate of having to hit some huge bottom? What can they do now today to make themselves better? Ah,

John Osberg 26:27
yeah, I love this conversation. That's a great question. Andrew, thank you. There's a couple, there's a more philosophical kind of concept that I have that I'll come back to, I want to make sure I directly answer your question. And here it is, you're struggling to identify who you are, or to say, say you have a pretty good grasp on who you are, who you want to be what you want to be doing, but you're still kind of unsure. Find your inner circle, call your inner circle, almost like a reporter. And you could even come out right up front. It's something that I've talked about in some of my coaching. It's something that I'm working on myself even call your inner circle. You know, Steve, you know, Nick, whoever, this is for me, like, these are some of my buddies. You know, Steve, when you think I mean, hey, you know, hey, man can maybe balance it a little bit. Hey, listen, I've been struggling to find my true identity. And really my ethos, my life ethos, and I'm curious if you could give me totally candid, unfiltered, high level opinion on who What do you think of me? You know, what do you when you think of a what do you think, right? What are some of the words, what are some of the titles or the tags that you think, you know, and so what you can start to do is maybe compile some trends, right. So if I were to call my inner circle, they're going to say connector, they're going to say, leader, they're going to say, Energizer coach, you know, friend, that, you know, just an absolute diehard of a friend, I mean, my inner circle knows that I literally would die for them, I would do whatever it would take to help them, serve them, be with them support them. And I know they would do the same for me. And that's why there's only a few of them, right? So I would say that exercise of calling the folks that are your trusted advisors your confidence, and speaking with them and say, Well, you What do you think when you think of me, as a person, as a professional, and start to write some notes, and then you can start to collect that? And then you can say to yourself after you've had some time to just kind of meditate and, and maybe have some Catholicism? Okay, look at all these notes, get all these descriptive words. What are the words in here that I want to be truly without an agenda without my job without society? What are the what are these descriptive words that really align with me? And then start to ingrain that in your brain, right one because people will ask Andrew when you're at an event, what's the first thing what do you do? See my face? Sorry, you can tell I don't like that question. What do you do? Like, it's not what we do. It's why we do it. Right? So for me, it's like what why are you here? You know, why do you get up every day and do what you do? So but I would say one last thing to that little bit of a rant is whether we want to believe it or not, we are needed. We really are. You know, and that's part of that exercise with calling your inner circle and even maybe your second ring of friends will help with that because you'll realize that you know, like you said with the mirror exercise where you stand in the mirror and you that that was a lightbulb moment for me. You know, you can get caught up in just seeing you know, like your nose and your hands and your lay and you don't see who you are outside of yourself. Whether it's literally physically or, or I should say literally or figuratively. And you are needed. You are You know, you're your son, your daughter, your You're a father your, you know, your mother, your whatever, all these you're a business person. You're a community leader, you're a coach. Whatever it is, you're someone, you can be someone's idol, whether you know it or not. And every single day realizing that and I've been, I've been coaching myself Andronik, because there's times where I struggle. And then people will just come out of nowhere on a LinkedIn message or a text or a call or in person and just say, Man, I saw that post or man that podcasts are man, that thing you did in the community, you know, last week, that really resonated that really inspired me and I went and did this or that, and I'm like, wow, you know, and so just reminding ourselves constantly, until it's just built, it's just built, it's just there. It's a mechanism that is always there. And always working. Until that day comes, we have to keep finding ways to remind ourselves.

Andrew Stotz 30:41
So ladies and gentlemen, a lot of words, yeah, explore who you are. And then I would say, build on that. Because that's what you're meant to be ultimately. And last question, what's your number one goal for the next 12 months,

John Osberg 30:58
I need to follow some of your footsteps or Andrew and building online digital courses that are around the ideas of transformation and magnetizing your life to bring in everything you want, and then kind of dispel with what you don't. And that's part of that inward thought, where it's like, I have some blocker that I'm still struggling to like, like, I know, like, I have these glimpses in my mind of like, man, like, I have done some cool things. And I know there are people who are out there who would benefit from this. But I keep saying, who's actually gonna buy a digital course? Who's really you know, who's gonna resonate with that, you know, that little voice in there that just says, No, no way. So, in 12 months from today, having a robust library of digital courses that are all about unlocking your growth on a variety of levels, is the goal for me is to really have that out there. So people can, you know, take little nuggets of whatever I've done, take it dude, Bruce Lee, take what's useful, discard what's not, you know, and then make it your own. Yep. So that's,

Andrew Stotz 31:59
that's exciting. And for the listeners out there, and also for you, John, as I've got six online courses that I've developed over the years, what I would say is, if somebody asked me about it right now, I would say, first thing you need to do is come up with your topic, second thing you need to do is do an outline, do an outline of, let's say, five topic points that you want to talk about. And then underneath each one of those, do a little bit more notes, right, and then get your iPhone out, put it on a stand and turn it on. And say this is module number one. And there's five modules in this course. But I'm going to talk about this one, which is x, y, z. And I'm going to tell you a little bit about it. And then you go through the three bullet points or so you have under that, and you turn off your camera after five or 10 minutes, and you record the next one, until you've got five of them. Each of them, let's say five minutes, you know, who's going to give you 25 minutes already to watch five, five minutes, 25 minutes, 30 minutes, 45 minutes, there's your course, put it up on a site, I use Thinkific. But whatever you use, sure, put it on the site, offer it for free, or for 10 bucks or five bucks, and say, here's what I got to give and start to drive people to it, get feedback, and then start to say, oh, part number four, I'm going to rebuild a little bit. Part number one, I'm going to rebuild and just do it. You can create a course in a weekend and have it up and running. And that's my advice after spending 1000s of hours creating courses that's what I would say to listeners but also to you, John. Wow,

John Osberg 33:43
I very grateful for that. So that's on air coaching that that is not taken lightly. I'm super grateful for that. That's and the one thing that you Yeah, well, I just want to say that one thing you did that I used to really not do well was is to keep it simple, right? And it's not keep it simple, stupid. I like to say keep it simple, silly. So So you know the kiss model is something that's been top of mind now for a while so that I have that all recorded here and I know this will come out so I'm in it once it's released. I'm going to go watch this part like 10 times and then create the create that course and I'll send you the first copy. Perfect.

Andrew Stotz 34:19
And what I always say to the people around me, I like to say is let's not insult ourselves. The world's hard enough on us. So instead of saying keep it simple, stupid, keep it simple. Still silly. Let's say keep it simple, smarty.

John Osberg 34:37
Hey, even better. I went from stupid silly you took it from silliness. Smarty. I

Andrew Stotz 34:43
learned Yep. So let's, let's support ourselves well, listeners. There you have it another story of loss to keep you winning. Remember to go to my worst investment ever.com and join our Facebook group to connect with our community of guests and fellow listeners. As we conclude, John, I want to thank you again for coming on the show. And on behalf of a Stotz Academy I hereby award you alumni status for turning your worst investment ever into your best teaching moment. Do you have any parting words for the audience?

John Osberg 35:16
I would just say keep serving to keep soaring. You know this when you serve. That's what helps you soar in life.

Andrew Stotz 35:24
Amen. And that's a wrap on another great story to help us create, grow and protect our well fellow risk takers. This is your worst podcast hose Andrew Stotz saying. I'll see you on the upside.